NPR’s Scott Detrow speaks with Sen. Lisa Murkowski about the potential loss of SNAP benefits due to the shutdown.
SCOTT DETROW, HOST:
Tomorrow, November 1, is the day federal food assistance will be cut or drastically reduced for tens of millions of people across the United States. The loss of SNAP benefits would be just the latest casualty of a month-long federal government shutdown.
Senate Democrats and the Trump administration remain entrenched, and as federal workers lose paychecks and people will now begin to miss out on critical food assistance, some lawmakers have talked about bills with more specific goals to keep specific parts of government funding flowing. Republican Senator Lisa Murkowski has been part of those conversations and others, as she often does, and now she joins us. Hello senator.
LISA MURKOWSKI: Hello. How are you this afternoon?
DETROW: Let’s start with this. SNAP is a broad program. About 66,000 Alaskans depend on it. What are you telling your constituents about what to expect and why those benefits are disappearing?
MURKOWSKI: Well, everyone has been paying attention to the news about this extended closure. They see these looming deadlines. It has been well advertised that SNAP benefits would end at the end of this month. And that is why my effort has been: let’s open this government. Let’s make sure that not only are SNAP benefits paid, but our military, our Coast Guard, our federal workers, our air traffic controllers are paid.
But we’re sitting here the day before these benefits are paid, and the clerk tells us the well is dry. So I think it’s a terrible situation. You mentioned the number in Alaska. Approximately 66,000 Alaskans rely on SNAP benefits. Nationwide, approximately 12% of the population relies on SNAP benefits.
DETROW: Yes.
MURKOWSKI: Forty-one million people – this is significant and it’s real harm to real people.
DETROW: I want to talk about the narrower bills to fund SNAP, the broader state of the negotiations. But first, I want to ask this, and this is tied to a federal court case that’s being decided right now, the question of whether the U.S. Department of Agriculture could fund SNAP right now with contingency funds. We’ve seen the Trump administration move money to continue paying members of the military, for example. First, do you think the administration has the power to keep SNAP going over the weekend?
MURKOWSKI: Well, they have contingency funds and we’ve asked very specifically about the ability to spend those contingency funds to help pay for SNAP benefits or at least partially. Once again, we have seen from the USDA and the Secretary of Agriculture the statement that that will not be a reality.
I have seen different statements indicating that these contingency funds should be reserved for disasters. We just had a disaster in Alaska. And so, for those SNAP recipients in Alaska who have experienced this disaster, yes, we want to make sure that they have some level of assistance or relief there.
But I think it is; It’s important to recognize that just this afternoon the courts issued a ruling ordering the Trump administration to pay for food stamps during this shutdown, saying they must distribute the aid using what they call an emergency fund pool. I don’t know what that is or where it could come from.
DETROW: And my understanding is that, at the earliest, that wouldn’t start until Monday. So I think either way, we’re looking for…
MURKOWSKI: Yes.
DETROW: …The weekend without these benefits.
MURKOWSKI: Well, and keep in mind that when there’s a gap in programs, a lot of times you’ll see a gap there. That’s why I felt it was so important that we not enter this place in the first place…
DETROW: Well…
MURKOWSKI: …Not being in a situation where we were actually going to see that these benefits couldn’t be paid and these people were left hanging and wondering how they were going to feed their family.
DETROW: Let’s step back for a moment because the Trump White House is not negotiating. Senate Democrats are saying they will not vote to reopen the government until there is a guarantee to extend these health care credits. You’re one of the, you know, sometimes it seems like members of the Senate are slowing down and they’re having conversations on both sides of the aisle. Do you see any clear path forward, or even the beginning of a path forward, right now?
MURKOWSKI: Yes. Yes. And it’s not that we are just now beginning to define a path. There have been a good number of people on both sides of the aisle who have engaged in good, constructive dialogue about the ways in which we will get through this shutdown, what it will look like. Good, constructive conversations are happening. They have been proceeding. They are happening now. AND…
DETROW: Is there a more likely path? I know negotiations can change quickly, but is there a more likely path? Is it a short-term spending bill? Is it a guarantee of a future vote? What do you think is the most likely way to…?
MURKOWSKI: I…
DETROW: …Move again?
MURKOWSKI: I think we’ll see an effort to ensure that we start moving forward on our appropriations bills that we’ve already passed in the full committee. Keep in mind that we wouldn’t be talking about a SNAP issue if we had been able to sign the farm appropriations bill into law. It’s already gone through the committee. All it takes is one conference and this wouldn’t be a problem at all. So whether it’s funding for the military, let’s pass the defense appropriations bill. If it’s funding for air traffic controllers, let’s pass the appropriations bill.
So I hope you see a path where we move our appropriations bills through the process here in the Senate, through the conference that we will have with the House; an opportunity for us, as a Senate, to address the ACA premium tax credits and the expiration we will see at the end of this year. And that’s obviously part of the mix.
The bill we have been voting on in the House is an extension until November 21st. That won’t be enough time for us. So how far do we go towards the end of the year? It is another topic of debate. But there is…
DETROW: What is your level of confidence that this will be done next first of the month, December 1st?
MURKOWSKI: My confidence level in this – that it will be ready by December 1 – is very high.
DETROW: Okay. That’s Republican Sen. Lisa Murkowski of Alaska. Thank you so much.
MURKOWSKI: Well, thank you very much, Scott.
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