The Pentagon says it is opening an investigation into Arizona Sen. Mark Kelly following a video of Democratic members urging service members not to comply with “unlawful orders.”
JUANA VERANOS, PRESENTER:
Defense Secretary Pete Hegseth says the Pentagon is investigating comments made by Arizona Democratic Sen. Mark Kelly. Last week, Kelly and five other Democratic politicians with military or intelligence experience released a video in which they said U.S. troops should not follow illegal orders.
(SOUNDBITE OF ARCHIVED RECORDING)
MARK KELLY: You can refuse illegal orders.
ELISSA SLOTKIN: You can refuse illegal orders.
CHRIS DELUZIO: You must reject illegal orders.
SLOTKIN: No one has to carry out orders that violate the law or our constitution.
VERANOS: President Trump responded on social media that this was, quote, “seditious behavior punishable by death.” But now one of the senators faces the threat of a court-martial from the Pentagon. NPR’s Quil Lawrence is here to explain. Hello.
QUIL LAWRENCE, SIGNATURE: Hello.
SUMMERS: Quil, start by reminding us exactly what that video is about. Why are all these Democrats talking about illegal orders?
LAWRENCE: Well, there are two areas here. Judges have ruled that some of the Trump administration’s deployment of National Guard troops against the will of state governors is illegal. But there are also the continued lethal attacks against vessels supposedly transporting drugs to the United States. And that’s another case where jurists and some European allies have said they don’t believe these killings are legal. So these are six veteran Democratic MPs who are reiterating what troops, and especially officers, learn is that you don’t have to follow illegal orders and that, most importantly, simply following orders is no defense for doing something illegal.
SUMMERS: Correct. So do you have any idea why the Pentagon is focusing specifically on Senator Kelly?
LAWRENCE: Yes. Secretary Hegseth was very clear about that. Of all those six, Kelly is the only one who is formally retired from the military and, as such, is a former Navy captain, former fighter pilot, so he may be called to active duty to face a court-martial. But I think this would be unprecedented. I spoke with military lawyer Kevin Carroll, a retired colonel who served in the first Trump administration, and he said the last thing that occurred to him was 1925, 100 years ago, but he was an active-duty officer. This is very different. And it appears, Carroll said, to be an attempt to silence political dissent.
KEVIN CARROLL: To do this to a retiree who is also, you know, a senator who was considered for the vice presidency and who could be a presidential candidate in 2028 is really a horse of a different color.
SUMMERS: Quil, has there been any response from Senator Kelly at this point?
LAWRENCE: Yes. He makes a statement. I will quote it partially. He said, “Secretary Hegseth’s tweet is the first I’ve heard about this. I also saw the president’s post saying he should be arrested, hanged and executed. If this is meant to intimidate me and other members of Congress from doing our jobs and hold this administration accountable, it won’t work.” He also posted a photo on social media of his dress uniform with a chest full of medals, which I think largely looks like trolling Secretary of Defense Pete Hegseth, who doesn’t have any combat medals that would normally be expected of someone of his position.
SUMMERS: Any idea where this all goes from here?
LAWRENCE: Well, the Pentagon said it was reviewing this. It’s not clear that he will actually be charged or court-martialed, especially since all these Democrats did was declare the US military code, but it’s a difficult situation for the troops right now. NPR and others have reported that the Justice Department has determined that these boat attacks are legal, so these troops must follow its orders. But the head of the Southern Command has already left his post and will soon leave his post. Four-star Admiral Alvin Holsey reportedly had reservations about these attacks. This is according to US officials who are not authorized to speak publicly.
SUMMERS: NPR’s Quil Lawrence. Thank you.
LAWRENCE: Thank you.
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